BAY ST. LOUIS, Miss. – Ostensible allies in the effort to remove the still-huge piles of debris left behind by Hurricane Katrina are engaged in an increasingly bitter conflict over the progress of the cleanup and the way it is being run.
The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers and its politically connected prime contractor AshBritt, which is overseeing the federal cleanup in most of Mississippi and parts of Louisiana, are in the middle of the fracas. In the wake of the Aug. 29 hurricane – the most destructive in U.S. history -- they have been fending off angry attacks as varied as the wreckage itself – a thick blanket of toppled trees, boards, bricks, shards of glass, wire, clothing and household items that still covers large parts of hard-hit communities along the Gulf Coast.
Maddest are local governments and citizens chafing over what they consider the lackluster pace of debris removal; critics of the process by which the federal contract expected to ultimately be worth $1 billion was awarded; and subcontractors who say their crews and equipment are standing idle even though they were promised abundant work.
Such criticism can be heard in virtually every coastal community between Alabama and Texas, but nowhere is it louder than in Bay St. Louis and Waveland, neighboring towns in Hancock County, Miss., that sustained some of the heaviest damage when Katrina’s 30-plus-foot storm surge crashed ashore.
One of the most outspoken critics is Waveland Mayor Tommy Longo, who charges that a combination of federal bureaucracy and private-sector dithering has substantially set back his city’s recovery.
“With the military, a lieutenant on the ground can make a decision,” he told MSNBC.com. “With FEMA and the Corps, the lieutenant has to run it up the chain of command and wait for someone else to decide what to do.”
'I don't think they're capable of doing the job'
He expresses equal disdain for AshBritt, noting that the Pompano Beach, Fla., environmental services firm is still bringing new subcontractors to Hancock County five months after the storm.
“A contractor like that should be able to get geared up in 30 days,” he said. “If they can’t get geared up in 90 days, I don’t think they’re capable of doing the job.”
The Corps and AshBritt also have been taking it on the chin from subcontractors alleging everything from incompetence in administering the contract to favoritism in handing out the cleanup assignments.
“I would just like to know how many contractors from Mississippi and from other states have gone home bankrupt because the Corps has jerked them around so much,” said Luke Theis, a contractor from Finley, Ohio, who rushed heavy equipment to the Gulf Coast only to see it stand idle for long periods waiting for it to be “placarded” – tagged with tracking numbers – and assigned to specific job sites.
Many locals say they haven’t fared much better.
Debbie Woodcock, a Hancock County landscaping contractor who lost $100,000 in heavy equipment to Katrina and then used her $30,000 insurance settlement to lease a tractor-hoe, a front-end loader and two trucks with 60-cubic-yard dump trailers, said AshBritt has given plum assignments in the most easily accessible debris fields to favored out-of-state contractors while her crew has been underutilized clearing rural roads.
“I do not fault (AshBritt) for bringing them in,” she said of the out-of-state competition. “There’s no way we could have handled this in the beginning ... but now we deserve a chance to make a living and keep the money in-house.”
Click 'Play' to see and hear Debbie Woodcock describe her experience as a subcontractor for AshBritt
Another local subcontractor, who spoke with MSNBC.com on the condition of anonymity because he said he feared retribution, said he was receiving good jobs from AshBritt, but was being hampered by “utterly incompetent” execution by the Corps.
“Our crews move around constantly .. .but often when they get to a new site, the supervisor doesn’t show up. So we end up sitting around, burning money,” he said.
Corps, contractor cite scope of job
Officials with the Corps and AshBritt say they understand the frustration, given that they and their grumbling partners are faced with the biggest disaster cleanup in U.S. history.
In Hancock County alone, the Corps and its contractors already have collected more than 3 million cubic yards of debris from public right of ways. That is less than half the estimated total of 7 million cubic yards of debris in the county, and reflects the fact that work is just beginning work on several vast debris fields – including a 2.5 acre wetland at Bayou La Croix estimated to contain 35,000 cubic yards of debris -- and its program to remove Katrina’s detritus from private properties is just hitting stride.
And Hancock County’s mounds account for a small slice of the total of 100 million cubic yards the Corps estimates was strewn around the Gulf Coast.
“I don’t know that anybody could have been prepared to respond to a storm of this magnitude,” said Jasper Lummus, the Corps’ mission manager for debris in Hancock County.
Lummus said the record number of hurricanes this season and foreign conflicts that taxed the Corps’ resources -- especially its ability to adequate numbers of on-site quality assurance inspectors -- added to the difficulties.
“We had to compete with Texas, Louisiana and Florida, not to mention Iraq and Afghanistan,” he said.<
AshBritt President Randal Perkins denies the company is being unfair in doling out assignments, adding that some out-of-state contractors have been given the biggest jobs because they have resources that the locals lack.
Complaints about fairness called inevitable
He also told MSNBC.com that such complaints are inevitable in such a chaotic situation.
“Seventy-two percent of every dollar we’ve spent has gone to Mississippi contractors,” he said. “… But you can’t make everyone happy. There’s always going to be somebody critical of what you’re doing.”
He also said the massive effort is making good headway and predicted the cleanup will be “significantly completed by the end of April (or) mid-May.”
In Hancock County, criticism of the pace of the cleanup has been fueled by data regarding the execution of Rights of Entry – the removal of debris on private property.
As of Jan. 26, the Corps had received 8,594 ROE forms from the county, but AshBritt’s subcontractors had completed debris removal on 1,073 properties – or 12 percent of the total -- over a seven-week period, according to figures provided by the county’s Emergency Operations Center.
In just four weeks, Beck Disaster and Recovery Services, a private contractor hired by the city of Waveland to clean debris north of the railroad tracks, completed 75 percent of the 705 ROE requests it has received from residents, according to data the firm provided to the city.
“Those numbers should be flip-flopped,” said Longo, Waveland’s frustrated mayor. “With the resources of the Corps and AshBritt, the numbers should be the opposite of what they are.”
AshBritt’s Perkins rejected the comparison, noting that the city’s southern sector sustained much heavier damage than the area north of the railroad tracks.
“The mayor’s entitled to his opinion,” he said. “But the cleanup now is relegated to private property and includes … demolishing houses. There’s a process involved and it’s far more time consuming than picking up wreckage on right of ways.”
But Waveland’s mayor isn’t the only one questioning the efficiency of the Corps-AshBritt effort.
Aldermen in Pass Christian, Miss., in neighboring Harrison County, voted in January to give the Corps and AshBritt two weeks to address complaints that work is progressing at a snail’s pace and that AshBritt isn’t hiring local subcontractors. The remainder of Harrison County and at least three other communities in Mississippi also have hired private contractors rather than go with the Corps and AshBritt.
That indicates a substantial level of distrust, since local governments must pay 10 percent of the total cost to outside contractors if they decide to shun the federal program, then seek federal reimbursement later.
Communities negotiate better deals
One reason for the break-away is that those communities have been able to negotiate cheaper deals than the rate called for in the debris cleanup contract the Corps awarded to AshBritt after an expedited open-bid process that lasted just three days, instead of the usual month or more.
The exact savings are hard to pin down, but Longo said that a Corps official told local officials at a meeting in October that AshBritt was being paid about $6 a cubic yard more than the $16.95 that Waveland is paying its prime contractor to remove and dump debris.
Alicia Embrey, a Corps spokeswoman, would not confirm that, saying only that AshBritt receives $17 per cubic yard hauled as well as “additional line items in the contract.”
“The prices paid per item are proprietary information (under the terms of the contract) and are not releasable,” she said.
But a line-item sheet for ROEs distributed by AshBritt to its subcontractors, a copy of which was provided to MSNBC.com, makes clear just how lucrative those extras can be. Among the prices paid to the subcontractors:
· $79 for each “hanger” – a limb 2 inches in diameter or larger removed because it poses a safety hazard.
· Payments of between $100 and $700 for “leaners” – dead or damaged trees angled more than 30 degrees.
· Up to $395 for the removal of stumps, with additional payments if dirt is brought in to fill the hole.
Such add-ons can add up, as one ROE job site that the Corps showed MSNBC.com demonstrated.
At the lot on Waveland’s Sandy Street, a subcontractor, Billy Joe’s Excavating from Owensboro, Ky., was in the process of removing what the Corps quality assurance specialist Dennis Murchison estimated “upwards of 400 cubic yards of debris” and 25 damaged trees from a lot on Waveland’s Sandy Street.
At the rate of $9 per cubic yard that AshBritt is paying subcontractors, that works out to an overall price of at least $11,100 for a three-day job, assuming the median rate for the trees. At a rate of $17 per cubic yard, and assuming the same rate for trees, AshBritt and other contractors higher up on the construction food chain would split another $10,700.
Firm connected to GOP, hired former Corps official
AshBritt's political connections and use of lobbyists led to some raised eyebrows when the company received the Katrina contract – worth an initial $500 million and another $500 million if the Corps triggers an option, which Perkins said he expects will occur in late February.
The Corps said at the time that AshBritt, and three other companies awarded cleanup contracts on an expedited basis, were selected from 22 bidders based on “past performance, technical capability, ability to provide sub-contracting goals for small and disadvantaged businesses, ability to respond, and price.”
But the company’s political connections have prompted congressional investigators to look into the contract and payments to its subcontractors, the New York Times reported in September.
Among the links presumably being scrutinized are the company’s $40,000 contract with the former lobbying firm of Mississippi Gov. Haley Barbour, a Republican stalwart who was Ronald Reagan’s White House political director and a former chairman of the Republican National Committee.
The Hill newspaper also has reported that AshBritt also hired the former head of the Corps, Mike Thompson, as its lobbyist shortly before it won the contract.
In addition, campaign records compiled by the nonpartisan group Political Money Line and reported by the Associated Press show Perkins, AshBritt’s president, and his wife, Saily, have given $50,000 to the Republican National Committee, $10,000 to the Florida Senate campaign of Mel Martinez, former secretary of housing and urban development in the Bush administration, and thousands more to the Florida GOP since 2000.
Also attracting attention was the insertion in the contract of language preventing the Corps from releasing information that AshBritt identifies as “proprietary,” such as the line-item payments.
Alex Knott, political editor for the Center for Public Integrity, said such that such language could be used to dodge public accountability.
“A lot of times companies don’t want to give out details of how they do business ... arguing that giving out this information would put them at a competitive disadvantage,” he said. “But it’s difficult to know whether that’s a legitimate concern without seeing the information that they’re withholding.”
AshBritt’s Perkins said his company won the contract on the merits of its bid and played down the importance of the non-disclosure clause, describing it as standard legal language.
“We’re not really worried about it getting in the hands of the competitors,” he said. “It will eventually become public.”
Conspiracy theories abound
The secrecy surrounding contract specifics has helped fuel conspiracy theories among those trying to make a living on the spoils of destruction.
Several Hancock County contractors interviewed by MSNBC.com, all of who spoke on condition of anonymity, said they have been quietly been told by AshBritt representatives to take their loads to a specific debris dump in the county.
“If you don’t, you don’t get any work the next time,” said one.
Others speculate that the company is handing out the best cleanup assignments to companies in which AshBritt has an investment, allowing it to “double dip” in the federal financial trough.
Perkins acknowledged that his company has “ownership interests in several companies around the United States that are involved in disaster related services,” but denied allegations of favoritism.
“We have no ownership stake in any dumps in Hancock County … (and) we don’t have any interest that would be considered in conflict with our contract,” he said.
Many Hancock County subcontractors interviewed in preparing this article also charged that AshBritt and the Corps have zero tolerance for complainers.
“I’m working with these people,” said one local subcontractor. “Maybe in a few months I can talk about my issues.”
One local offered up an example to back up the charge: Gerald Charles, owner of a Bay St. Louis construction company with heavy equipment at the ready.
Charles, he said, antagonized AshBritt and the Corps by complaining at a Board of Supervisors meeting that he had been given no cleanup work despite an assurance from company officials that he would be among the first hired.
“Gerald pushed too hard and made a lot of people mad,” the contractor said.
Charles, interviewed outside the FEMA trailer he is sharing with his family, said the only work he has been able to land since Katrina was a grading job from the county, and has received not a single job from AshBritt despite many visits to the firm’s local office.
He reiterated the complaint he made at the supervisors meeting, saying the shutout was doubly painful since he is effectively being prevented from working for neighbors who would have hired him if they weren’t waiting for Corps contractors to come in and clean their lots for free.
“I told them, ‘Look, not only didn’t you allow me to work, you took work away from me,’” he said.
A beacon of hope in Waveland
Zero comments??? This article says that AshBritt basically bribed their way into the contract and is doing a poor job at cleanup. Has the nation lost interest in the devastated southern coastline? Or is the outcry censored by the blog-keepers?
Mark Guest blown out of Waveland and soon to be in Asheville, NC (Sent Jan 28, 2006 9:17:40 PM)
Seems to be just another nail in the coffin of the Republican Administration to "take care of the good ole boys" and screw the American Tax payer.
J. Littman, Lake Tahoe, Ca. (Sent Jan 29, 2006 6:38:52 PM)
For crying out loud! For just ONCE in this country's lifetime, put the economics and one-upmanship aside and let's get these communities up and running again! I find it ironic, in a sarcastic sort of way, that Katrina blew away all these lives and the trappings that surrounded lives, but it wasn't strong enough to blow away the red tape. Cripes! Another classic example of capitalism run amok.
Stephanie Umbro, Maine (Sent Jan 29, 2006 9:10:47 PM)
Hmmm. AshBritt is preventing other companies from earning a living? It sounds like a good case for a class-action suit against the Corps of Engineers and AshBritt. I guess Enron and Halliburton still haven't awakened the American people to blatent corporate corruption and profiteering at the expense of those in need.
Robert Hagaman, Asheville, NC (Sent Jan 30, 2006 1:11:33 AM)
The debris removal process here in Jackson and Harrison counties, MS are abhorent. Filing debris removal papers is a chaotic nightmare with advertised centers having people travel to 3 different locations to file papers. I have not seen one single Mississippi truck hauling debris. The debris removers themselves are now proving to be a hinderance. On congested roadways (as so many outlets into and out of cities are destroyed) the slow moving trucks occupy all available lanes, usually driving side by side of each other. They are required by law to cover their haul, however I have not seen one single truck covered since the storm. Debris now lies in the roads and strikes passing vehicles as it falls out.
We are eternally grateful for the help and aid we have recieved from all volunteers. These folks, however, are not here out of charity and goodwill. They're here for the fat paychecks the government is shelling out. Most residents are ready for them to go home and put our people to work. People who care about this area, understand the flow of it, and aren't just out here to make a buck.
Bonnie, Ocean Springs, MS (Sent Jan 30, 2006 7:55:38 AM)
Oversight.
Who benefits?
Greed at the expense of others?
A neutral party or governing body without its finger in the honey jar should be evaluating the situation. This entity should access the capabilities of the subcontractors, main contractors and the need of the communities effected. This process on the surface a seem a simple idea until one looks at the cost of the contract of $500,000 dollars (which is the first tasted of the honey). What should be part of any governmental contract like this is published minutes of every meeting and published information on every charge made connected to every site worked on. All these transactions held up to public scrutiny would have a very cleansing effect. All contract decisions made should have reasoning behind them and the information held public. One, this would indicate to the tax payers where the money is going, their money. Two, this information would help indicate who is holding up the process and not buzzing to get the job done.
Whether it is contractors in Iraq or Mississippi when the sum of $500,000 million is involved the quickest paws are first to empty the honey jar at the expense and needs of others. Open up the process. Does the company ENRON teach us anything?
PS I work as a project Manager for a post reconstruction company that gets the job done.
Ted Cazel, Robertsdale, AL (Sent Jan 30, 2006 10:18:45 AM)
It is ironic that the great outcry for government assistance has been answered, and we've gotten exactly what we asked for -- government assistance, which is unfortunately more like government affliction.
My friends have poured themselves into the cleanup effort and have met with disappointment after disappointment because of the web of governmental red tape that snarls the very ones who have come to the rescue.
Todd Mitchell, New Brighton, MN (Sent Jan 30, 2006 10:31:42 AM)
How terribly sad! Why should ANYONE profit from another's misfortune. Why can't these contractors go in with an hourly rate, work their fannys off until the job is done and go home? Shame on every last one!
Susi Folks, California (Sent Jan 30, 2006 11:00:03 AM)
Another example of this goverments failures and dissapointments. We are dealing with a bunch of thieves. Plain and simple. The president does not give a rats ass about you people in Missisippi or New orleans. Look at the response in New York after 9/11. It was a podium for Bush. Things got done a lot quicker. ( More things than we wanted! ) This president has no clue and he does not care. If he did, things would be different.. God forbid there be another disaster. You poor people, my heart and prayers go out to you all.
George Dineen (Sent Jan 30, 2006 11:28:15 AM)
Thousands of federal employees have done nothing except work 12-14 hours a day, seven days a week, since Katrina came ashore, to help clean up the mess. Your article fails to properly give them the credit they so richly deserve.
Rick Fulton (Sent Jan 30, 2006 11:51:30 AM)
My sister lives in Diamonhead, MS, She had an excellent experience with the Corps of Engineers handling the debris removal on her property. The trees, brush, and houshold debris were cleared efficiently. The crew did a great job. They did arrive about 2 weeks later than when she was told they would be there. But other than that, it was a blessing to have the help when everything in you life has become overwhelming.
Janet Tucker, Lynchburg, VA (Sent Jan 30, 2006 12:04:44 PM)
ASBRITT COST ME AND MY PARTNERS OVER $100,000 IN DELAYS AND NON WORK PROMISED... I DON'T KNOW OF A SINGLE CONTRACTOR THAT MADE ANY PROMISED MONEY... ASHBRITT 'S FIRST CONTRACT STATED THAT IF WORK WAS AWARDED AND FOR ANY REASON (FIRED) YOU HAD TO LEAVE ALL YOUR EQUIPMENT BECAME ASHBRITT'S.. ARE WE FOOLS???
EDWARD FOSTER (Sent Jan 30, 2006 12:17:57 PM)
First of all, all of the debris removal is 100% federal right now whether the Corps does it or the locals do it. This article states that it's 100% federal if the Corps does it and 10% cost shared if the locals do it - that's wrong.
Second,as far as progress in Waveland on ROE work, Waveland's contractor only has to work in the city limits north of the railroad tracks, while the Corps is responsible for debris everywhere else in the County. Also, the Corps was told by the locals to concentrate on the Right of Way removal first and then work on ROE as a second priority.
Third, it has always been the responsibility of the local government to respond to these disasters. If they can't do it, then they are supposed to ask their County for help. If the County can't do it, then they are supposed to ask the State. If the State can't do it, then they request help from FEMA and when it comes to debris, FEMA will task the Corps. If the locals have the ability to contract for the work themselves, the Corps shouldn't be involved. The Corps has a mindset that put's safety first and due to that, will put more constraints on a contractor that will normally slow progress, but get the work done in a safer manner. They will also monitor contractors more closely to insure they are picking up only eligible debris. That can also slow the process.
Lastly, when the prices were originally negotiated, the contractor was probably required to bring in fuel and lodging for their crews because it was not available locally. Plus the contractor is required to take more monetary risks because they have to put "money on the street" for several weeks before the government paperwork can follow up to put money in their hands.
While this article may have some good points in it, it appears to be too simplistic and more of an attack job than an impartial reporting of facts. As usual, it's easy to target the "big, bad, government" and "evil big business".
Billy, Daphne, AL (Sent Jan 30, 2006 12:25:40 PM)
It is appearing that large amounts of moneys set aside for disaster recovery cannot be managed from the top down. We have too many cooks in the kitchen. Additionally it is appearing that a most efficient method of spending and getting the most for the buck is to simply give the moneys to the local governments. Requiring a spending budget submitted by local Mayors and auditing spending against that budget by the guys at the top seems to be a much better approach. Let the guys living in the middle of this disaster handle it. Let them request what is needed, let them direct the Corps of Engineers when and where needed, let them handle the subcontracting for clean up. Everyone just needs to get out of their way and they'll get the job done more quickly and less expensively
Don, Iowa (Sent Jan 30, 2006 12:37:48 PM)
I'm surprised to see that theres not a Bush-Chaney owned Construction Contractors doing the work along with Halliburton.
Any group that can have 10's of millions of dollars un accountable but spent in Iraq can surley loose a few more million here in the States as well.
Damed I just now noticed that my Computer is bugged
wow now who would want to bug a old man's computer-goes to show ya never know.
Buck Bullard (Sent Jan 30, 2006 12:41:05 PM)
Human greed and major levels of mendacity seem to appear anywhere $ is being handed out. State Attorneys General should appoint independent boards to investigate. Perhaps egregious behavior should be classified by state legislators as felonies.
Gerald Thebeau, St. Louis, MO (Sent Jan 30, 2006 12:54:54 PM)
As a volunteer who just returned from New Orleans, I cannot begin to describe just how much debris there is. The trash lines streets, is in the streets, and more often than not, still in the buildings. I saw some contractors work feverishly without a break and I witnessed some being purely greedy by taking unnecessary free meals. The task of removing all the debris is daunting and I can understand why many would be intimidated. The trash must be picked up, sorted through and then distributed. It will be years before all is well again.
Bonnie, Boston, MA (Sent Jan 30, 2006 1:10:34 PM)
I live in Long Beach, MS and agree that all of the removal is running at a less than snails pace. The way things are going now, it will be 50 years before the coast is cleared and rebuilt. The casinos are coming back full force and some are up and running, which is great for the government and economy, but how in the world are they going to make any money from the locals, if there is still a large portion of residents still living in tents?!
Stacie Skaggs, Long Beach, MS (Sent Jan 30, 2006 1:48:18 PM)
quit complaining, first it wasn't done and now it isn't done right, what else did you expect if you did not do it yourself. the government can't even take care of basic needs, be glad, dusty or not that halliburton is getting all the money. you are just making bush and chaney richer by the minute. and you are just a little minute grain of sand in the big picture. i am sorry if i am attacking the government but something is wrong here.
r ta jacksonville fl 32207 (Sent Jan 30, 2006 2:14:52 PM)
Sounds like more GOP corruption at the best. The one contractor should take Ashbritt, the Army Corp, and Federal Gov't to court over its lack of a spine to taking complaints and refusing him to get work.
Sean (Sent Jan 30, 2006 2:47:27 PM)
And the world wants to know what is wrong with America. It is written all over this article, it is called corruption. We have a never ending supply and corruption is utilized in every situation even ones that involve catastrophes involving our own citizens. I am about ready to move to Sweden.
Ron Reid, Lutz Florida (Sent Jan 30, 2006 2:56:29 PM)
Typical business as usual government mentality.
NEVER FORGET: The government's job is to funnel
tax payer dollars to the big guy, not the little guy.
The little guy has never counted to Unca Sam.
Katrina victims need cash and shelter.
That should be the priority, not residue removal or
trash clean-up. Katrina victims can clean up their
own yards, so let's pay them to do it, not big
contractors from out of state.
.....Lee Suba
Colorado
Lee Suba, Denver CO (Sent Jan 30, 2006 3:12:48 PM)
I am all for helping the people who were impacted by Katrian, but to be honest with you my sympathies are thinning. We all have experience hard ship and yes it sucks, so Pick yourselves up by the boot straps and get on with your life!!!!
Victoria Erickson (Sent Jan 30, 2006 3:35:30 PM)
Rendering assistance to those in need is a necessary and nobel act, but these people are turning into chronic complainers that are never satisfied.
RA Platt, Universal City, TX (Sent Jan 30, 2006 3:35:38 PM)
Thanks to MSNBC for following up and doing what they said they would. Wish that more people in that area were sending in diary entries so we could see their side of events.
shine, decatur, al (Sent Jan 30, 2006 3:48:52 PM)
I'm sure every administration since this country was born has played favorites when it comes to contracts with the government. What brings more attention to the Bush administration in awarding contracts is it seems the companies getting the business this time around seem to be more concerned about getting the jobs (and the money) and less concerned about doing the jobs and hence, helping people.
Rob Gilliam, Katy, Texas (Sent Jan 30, 2006 3:51:03 PM)
Why don't you get off your lazy b-hinds and help clean up the mess instead of constantly complaining!! Now it is time for all to work, like it or not!!!! I'm tired of shelling out thousands yearly just so you can sit back and bad mouth the government, city and state officials! GET OVER YOURSELVES!!!!!!!!! REMEMBER.... God help's those that help themselves!!
TGP (Sent Jan 30, 2006 4:21:39 PM)
PLAIN AND SIMPLE..BUSH AND THE REPUBLICAN CONGRESS PUT CRONIES IN THESE POSITIONS AND THEY ARE TO BLAME!!!look at the cronies who are over the timber and mining industries...and now they want to investigate mining accidents. Give me a brake. We have the worst government in American History. They will have silly hearing on steriods in baseball but NOT ONE HEARING ON THE AFFECT OF GLOBAL WARMING and what needs to be done to correct the already 1 percent rise of the earths temperature..Oh thats right , I forgot. Bush is too busy spying on Americans and ofcourse Fear Mungering to stay in office..Never mind!!
Brett, Dallas Texas (Sent Jan 30, 2006 4:33:27 PM)
Wow, this is yet another example of the GOP corruption. You know, the strange thing is, I hear people in the US complaining that we should not be spending so much money to clean up Katrina and Rita. After all, they chose to live in that region. So, how about this, why are we paying to clean up Iraq, not our own people. We can't even have enough deceny to take care of our own, yet those who complain are the same ones who support the Iraq war, claiming we cannot leave.
Michelle, Portland, OR (Sent Jan 30, 2006 4:33:49 PM)
To Victoria Erickson and RA Platt: I know it gets quite exhausting listening to these people "complain" but from someone who grew up in Bay Saint Louis and has been back four times since the storm - it is a miserable situation. Please, please take me up on this...I will pay your flight to Mississippi - don't pack any clothes - we can stop at any one of the many mounds of donated clothes that have been soaked by rain and covered in dust and who knows what else - then we can eat all of our meals at the "food tent" after cleaning all day or waiting in a line somewhere or maybe we can go sit with my cousin and his wife, four small children and three dogs in their FEMA trailor. You want people to pick themselves up by the boot straps?? Most everyone there, including all of my family lost everything - including those boot straps. If you are tired of it - stop reading about it. I will pray that you never encounter anything as devastating. Email me if you want that free vacation to BSL...
Hayden Larroux, Washington, DC (Sent Jan 30, 2006 4:37:17 PM)
Clean up your own yards! Get on with your life! Please, you have no idea of the amount of destruction and debris in this area. I just drove down the recently opened Highway 90 from Pass Christian to Gulfport and still five months after the storm, it looks like it happened just yesterday. I'm afraid that when your house is leaning at a 45 degree angle and your 200 year old oak trees are uprooted it is not a task that a home-owner can get out and just do themselves. If you haven't witnessed in person what has happened to the Gulf Coast, then your comments have no merrit. Direct your attention elsewhere.
Lisa D., Gulfport, Mississippi (Sent Jan 30, 2006 4:40:20 PM)
It's a terrible thing, a hurricane. But a more terrible thing is for people affected by it to continually whine. While the majority of the whining is done by New Orleans and its do nothing leadership, it's about time people take it upon themselves and get with it. The gov't is only supposed to protect you, not cover every aspect of your life, (unless you're a Democrat). So give the rest of us a break from your complaining and start getting busy cleaning up!
C. Warren, Laurinburg, NC (Sent Jan 30, 2006 4:44:36 PM)
As far as the ROE's, shouldn't we start with homeowners that need debris cleared from their property so they can start to rebuild? Instead we are clearing the side of the road and removing trees. Why are there so many workers sitting in their cars? Why do they just get the "big stuff" and leave? Why don't they deal with the whole street at one time so they don't have to keep coming back tearing up what's left of our roads(not to mention the cost of the crews loading and unloading)? Why don't they hire more workers? Just wondering.
Kelyn, Bay St. Louis, MS (Sent Jan 30, 2006 4:46:53 PM)
Being from the South I am infuriated and imbarassed and the assumption that when something tragic happens the government of these Great United States is totally held responsible for the failings of locals. These locals expect too much in a world where children are hungry, AIDS is rampant, tsunamis and earthquakes are killing hundreds of thousands.
Stand up, pull up your boot straps, and dig in. Have honor and dignity!!!
Christy Orosco Reno, NV (Sent Jan 30, 2006 4:51:18 PM)
I know several people that went to South Louisiana to get a piece of the action. Hoping to help with the clean up and get paid while doing so. This in turn would help New Orleans and some of the contractors - because of the slow economy, they could use a financial boost. But no, no one wants to share the wealth any more. It is controlled by the rich and distributed by the rich. Sounds like a republican to me.
The bad thing is, the top dogs do their stealing right in front of your face, eveyone just sits back and complains. What happen to the morals and standards this Country was founded on. I guess it offened someone!!!
I was always taught to help people less fortunate than yourself, (if you have the means) and God will bless you for it.
And if they are a Christian they will do this!
Several people have told us, they went down to the disaster areas, and did the work, but had to come back broke, because no one would pay them. This put alot of people further in debit. Not to say - What happend with the Trust issue!
Smith, Natchitoches, Louisana (Sent Jan 30, 2006 5:08:17 PM)
For another view of the waste, check out what is happening with the survivors that were relocated to Oklahoma.
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread167902/pg1
Larry Denman, Tulsa, OK (Sent Jan 30, 2006 5:09:49 PM)
I know first hand and have seen some of the favortism that this article speaks of. Before Katrina, there was Ivan and Dennis. Both of which destroyed my part of the country.
It's too bad that most of the money the goverment is throwing at this problem will not stay in the area that needs it. Randall Perkins is rich and getting richer by the truckload. Both Harrison and Hancock counties would be doing themselves a favor if they could get rid of Ashbritt and Beck.
Independent contractors, locals, who want to work and want to help are being stiffled by the "Big Guy's" ability to capitalize on and withstand the beauracratic paper shuffle.
Randall Perkins, you're rich enough, retire.
Pensacola, Fl. (Sent Jan 30, 2006 5:15:24 PM)
Thank God someone is actually talking about the mess that is going on down in the gulf coast. I work in the debris removal business from both the contracting and consultant side. What is happening with Ashbritt is unexcusable. They say they are hiring locals. This just isn't true. Ask them about the W912EE-06-R-0005 contract that the corp is about to award. Ashbritt protested and actually got the bid closing moved from 1/18 to 1/31 because of a preference given to Mississippi contractors. Ask Randy about him denying a good contractor simply because he had a past relationships to his sisters ex husband. If someone wanted I can give easily over 25 names and numbers of contractors that were either not paid, or promised something before they left only to have the terms changed when they arrived on site. Explain why the guys actually doing the work (third tier subs) are getting less than half of the money that the government is actually expending. I know because I negotiated the contracts! Someone please ask Randy about the accuracy and eligibility of the small business development loans that he and Sally took out in the 80's. I've worked in this business for 15 years and I have never seen anything this bad. Randy, along with Byrd Brothers, is getting rich while the local people suffer. I know one contractor that made $1,000,000 in 20 days last year and it was all from the number of sub contractors he had signed up underneath them, Not because of the amount of equipment that they had. Isn't it time that we started to do something to make sure our money is being spent appropriately?
John Doe, Winterhaven, FL (Sent Jan 30, 2006 5:21:30 PM)
My husbnd driving one of those debris removal trucks in the gulf coast region right now. And I don't know where the free meals are? But I can assure you that we are not making a the big bucks people say they are. And many of the contractors are paying their crews out of pocket with no real assurance of when their money is coming. I have also watched as people drove around flagmen and cussed at crews for being on their roads.When I first arrived in the area my first reaction was to cry because i thought all of these poor people both the wealthy and poor they have lost everything. My reaction now is there are some nice people there, but for the most part they are people who are rude and are just like the contractors and workers they complain about out for themselves and what they can get for nothing from the government. It seems to be becoming the American way.
Brenda (Sent Jan 30, 2006 5:25:34 PM)
Looks like more business-as-usual for Bush and his GOP team...if there's a way for him to reward the giant corporations that put him in office, he'll find it, and then when Americans figure out what's going on, he'll appear on TV with his "why is everybody picking on me?" expression and act genuinely confused as to why anyone would question his honesty and ability to lead in a time of crisis. I can just imagine him, Rove, and Cheney yukking it up back at the White House at how easy it is for them to do whatever they want and not have to worry about accountability.
Steve, Inkster, Mich. (Sent Jan 30, 2006 8:20:01 PM)
Okay, I read the article as well as a dozen or so comments. The theme is greed and this is correct. Politics and greed are causing extreme grief to residents of this county. I know, first hand. I own a small company and we have been working in Waveland for three weeks. First, let me explain something. Ashbritt according to the article is paid 17.00 per cubic yard, plus the tree incentives. Want to know what the ground crews, the ones actually doing the work are making? $6.00 a yard and approximately 60% of the tree incentives as described in the article. Why? Ashbritt is lazy. The passed work on to subcontractors, who then took a couple bucks off the top, then passed it on to subcontractors who took a couple bucks off the top and then based it on...well you get the idea. We are currently a 5th tier contractor doing all the ground work while 4 contractors above us make money on our work. We have three large trucks, a large exavator, a bobcat, 6 man crew, liability insurance, work comp insurance, fuel expense and to top it off, while Corp employess and volunteers are provided food and lodging, we have to fend for ourselves. Six men living in a 30 foot trailer with no electricity or potable water. We average 400 cubic yards a day. You do the math. The work is not being done because ground crews cannot earn the "fat payday" one commentator posted. Folks, yes, we are here to earn a living, but we also are deeply concerned about the well being of these people. The live in tents and fema trailers. They have lost everything. Many are poor and now poorer. Most did not carry flood insurance. The community has limited commercial outlets. I will never eat a Wendy's burger again when I get home. Wallmart has turned into a Cosco and its the only grocery store in the county. You can see the despair in the peoples faces. At this point, we are loosing money. A truck breaks down, $3,000 grand, a rainy day, no work is done, a QC doesn't show up, no work for the day. Please don't blame the ground crew contractors for this messs and yes it is a mess. FEMA needs to pay appropriate wages and the work will get done. As long as the compensation remains the way it is, scab crews will be cleaning up this mess, and believe me, the work is less than poor. Like I said, been there three weeks, we have yet to be paid. Nearly 20k in the whole at this point because our employess need a paycheck, fuel needs to be bought daily, maintenance on the CAT and trucks is required and of course our insurance carriers are not waiting until we get paid. You can blame the government all you want, I am with you 100%. this is the most unorganized storm I have ever worked. The problem lies with Ashbritt's greed and the inability of a leader, somewhere in our government to rectify the problem. Our hearts go out to you folks in Waveland and all the homes and properties we have cleaned were met with high praise and gratitude from the homeowners. Kudos to you folks for staying the course in the face of adversity, our hats go off to you. We are here to help regardless of our bottom line. You can count on us.
Joseph, melbourne florida (Sent Jan 30, 2006 9:23:52 PM)
After working hurricaine cleanup last year in central florida with my trucks I would only do it again if it was the last job to be had. The truckers were paid 2.50 per cu yard hauled. no reimbersment for damages to equipment (tires, holes in beds,broken sideboards,etc.) forced to clean up the same areas three to four times. All the time while 4 to 5 people try to decide how full your truck is. WAKE UP AMERICA. There are contracters who can repair damaged bridges with speed and quality (IE I 40 Webbers Falls,OK and I 10 Pensacola, Fl) faster than your cleanup contractors. FEMA is only breakneck speed at renting hotel rooms and rental cars for way to many inexpirenced people to vacation rather than work.
Dave, Winter Haver, Florida (Sent Jan 31, 2006 8:49:23 AM)
LET THE PEOPLE THAT LIVE THERE HAVE THE WORK, SOMETIMES YOU GOT TO TAKE THE PENCIL PUSHERS OUT OF THE PICTURE, AND LET THE REAL WORKING PEOPLE OF THE REGION FIX THE PROBLEM. IF IT HAD BEEN HANDLED PROPERLY AN EXISTING COMPANY WOULD BE HANDLING IT AND NOT SOME DUDE THAT THINKS HE MIGHT BE SICK BECAUSE HE'S BREAKING SWEET.LIKE THE OLD SAYING MORE MONEY STOLEN FROM GUYS IN SUITS AND TIES THAN ANY ONE CARRYING A GUN. THIS PROVES IT AGAIN.
RICK STEWART (Sent Jan 31, 2006 9:26:37 AM)
It seems that in times like this,huricane Katrina, the Devil comes out to gather his flock. I don't understand why in such devastation there has to be so much mud slinging. God put us here to love and help one another. We have 2 choices, do his work or do the devils. The blame must go somewhere. Not only does it belong to the Federal Govt. but to the State and Local Govts. as well. The majority of the American people put Bush in office, not once but twice. We have no one but our selves to blame for a lot of what goes on.
When I read the comments by the lady whose husband is driving a debris removal truck I was taken aback. Being treated shabbily by the people you are are trying to help must be a big bite to swallow. I doubt that I would work very hard to help someone that couldn't show some appreciation.
Cherry Ky. (Sent Jan 31, 2006 9:54:33 AM)
I know its going to sound a bit corny, but if you read the paragraph below.... I think its about time we do what it says and "abolish" this government. It's become "destructive", and I want a "new government for my future security."
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.–That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,–That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."
Andrea, MA (Sent Jan 31, 2006 11:00:09 AM)
i am just so sick of all the big dogs getting all the money for goodness sakes ashbritt, leave the job for the locals quit getting in big matches over money when you have enough of it already!!!! there are locals out there who want to work but you keep budding your noses in so they cant work and as for paying the third tier subs $6/cy come on they do all the work while you are out golfing or playing it up in vegas why not settle for less??? this is going to go on for ages if they dont step down and let us locals in for once. i am with all the lower end subs who work and work but dont reap the benefits. i applause msnbc for following up on this what i believe needs to be done is a followup on what ashbritt has done in the past and all the bribes they give out just so they can get a contract!!!!!
laurel gulfport (Sent Jan 31, 2006 12:31:16 PM)
One again I feel compelled to say something. I feel that my last comment was incomplete.
Reading over everyone's comments thus far, I see a lot of people saying that those from Mississippi that are dealing with this everyday are unjustified for being so upset.
Imagine if you came home from work today, and instead of finding your house, family, pets waiting for you, you walked up and the only thing you can recognize is the steps leading up to what used to be your porch. Imagine that after seeing your clothing and what used to be your home, scattered throughout your yard and your neighbors. Then imagine that before all of this has even had a chance to sink in, you get a phone call on your cell phone that you were just fired from your job. And, after all of this you are told by your friends, family, insurance company, and government to deal with it yourself. Kind of sucks, correct?!
The people from Mississippi are not complaining just to complain. All of this is justified. We didn't complain after the weak response of the federal and state agencies just after the storm. We were down here trying to figure out what to do next, and how to go about doing it.
We pay taxes the same as everyone else. So after paying the federal government for many years, we feel that we should receive some type of service from them. Many of the residents in South Mississippi would be more than willing to do the work themselves, if they had the funding to do it, and were physically able to do it.
It takes money to do everything in this country, and the problem with what is going on with this article, is that the Americans money is being wasted. Everyone should have something to say about this situation. The money belongs to us, the Americans. If you hired someone to do a job at your home, and after you gave them the check, they just sat in your front yard on lawn chairs and drank beer, wouldn't you be a bit upset? Same situation, just on a larger scale.
So before you go running your mouth about things you can't even begin to comprehend, remember that the money that is being MIS-USED here is YOUR MONEY TOO!!!!!
Stacie Skaggs Long Beach, MS (Sent Jan 31, 2006 12:54:36 PM)
How is the city going to rebuild it self if the money and jobs of this type don't stay in house ? This is the kind of goverment we asked for when we voted George Bush in. There shouldn't be any complaining now that we got exactly what we asked for. 4 more years. How can articles like this be written and nobody in the White House even flinch ?This is America, land of the free, where everybody but the poor and middle class (The rich) have the advantage. But we wanted this by asking for " 4 more years", incompitence from the Bush administration.
Manny Pineda (Sent Jan 31, 2006 1:42:53 PM)
i am not complaining about the gulf not wanting to do the job i know for a fact two companies from the gulf who want to work but ashbritt keeps butting their noses into the system to get the contracts i personally feel bad for the people that got hit by katrina and i know the feeling cause i was there once in my life. but the simple fact is i know that people do want to work that do have the funding and for some reason or another it just isnt happening cause the big dogs just want to keep coming in and getting the piece of the pie which i feel that they just need to step back and finish what they started which obviously isnt alot cause they are taking there good ole time at doing it! one thing that i do know is that all these contractors are just "milking" the system to keep the cleanup going on and on so they can make all the big loot i just say clean up the stuff so these people can get on with their lives and rebuild!!!!!
jim ms (Sent Jan 31, 2006 2:24:02 PM)
We are a New York based construction contractor who is registered with FEMA, GSA, CCR and everyone else. We had crews organized and ready to leave immediately after the storm. No calls, no contracts, nothing. With resources standing ready, in the area or miles away and the work still not being done, this was definitely mismanaged. The Government would be better off awardnig the contarcts directly. What a mess (no pun intended)
Ed Newman (Sent Jan 31, 2006 2:31:20 PM)
This is terroism of the God of ______ and in any case of disaster secaracy is necessary. This is a war against _____. And freedom and openness of contracts has nothing to do with it.
This is a shame that the very people who are distroyed by the strom are not allowed to go back their home and fix it. But some contractor on fat pay is cleaning the pockets of tax payers.
John Wayne, Tempa, FL (Sent Jan 31, 2006 4:00:26 PM)
I really wish those who perceive us as being lazy could see us down here. Everybody is working. We are taking
our appliances, our drywall, our furniture, carpet,
and flooring out of the house and out onto the curb.
This is where it is supposed to go, for the Corps to
pick up, as per the suggestions of local officials.
Alternatives include getting a truck and hauling
it to the dump yourself. The dump is far and it
ain't free. Furthermore, some of the trash (esp.
what's inside the fridge) is decaying organic
matter. Unsafe for anyone to mess with at close
distance, which is what it ends up being if you
haul it off yourself.
I think a lot of the perception problem is due to
disaster fatigue. I felt the same after 9/11 or after
the 1993 floods in the Midwest - "aren't they done
yet? why aren't things normal yet?"
I doubt I will ever feel that way again.
J., Bay Saint Louis MS (Sent Jan 31, 2006 6:04:22 PM)
WHAT A MESS...man this is craZy
andy,ms (Sent Feb 1, 2006 9:18:31 AM)
I have read many of the comments posted here & I understand it is much easier to point the finger at the government & big business and say they are to blame. Yes there has been a terrible breakdown of the whole rebuilding process and yes there are people making more money than they deserve on other peoples misfortunes but this type of story needs to be put on the news everyday so that people can be shown what is going on. I applaude MSN for letting us know how it really is. In America today it is easy to lose yourself in your own problems & life, to forget about Katrina & those it touched but we need to remember them & to help fight for them. Let's stop blaming & put that energy to good works whether it be as simple as praying for good honest reliable assistance for those in need or contacting our governmental officials & let them know that though it is not our state that is involved that something for the victims needs to be done now, this needs to be done until something happens. In a perfect world it would be great if some type of non-profit organization could be formed to coordinate the whole clean-up and rebuilding effort without political or corporate sponsorship. But hey we would be living in Utopia then! I know that our system is flawed but at least we have a system, they are trying to help though it may not appear that way. The great thing about our country is if you don't like something you need to exercise your right & stand up and do something about it. I thank God for the life that I have every day & I will continue to pray for those touched by Katrina.
Lyn S., Hudson, WI (Sent Feb 1, 2006 9:30:14 AM)
Why is it God's creatures can find a way to survive this terrible tragedy months after, when 3-5 days after the storm news crews were showing people on video complaining they hadn't eaten a decent meal for days, and they were starving? Seems to me our furry friends have a little more grey cells than some of the 2 legged ones! It also looked to me the people caught on camera could have afforded to miss a couple of meals. I feel lucky to live in this Country and if you don't you can change the way things are done or you have the choice to leave. You also had this same choice months ago! It is time for you to move on and make a new life, and please make it the right one!
Julie, WA (Sent Feb 1, 2006 9:31:44 AM)
My home was also flooded, I also lost everything, during Alison. I am a single mom with very little to begin with. I pulled myself together, cleaned up the mess and started over. I did not, nor did I ask for the govt. to come clean up the mess for me. If I can do it, anyone can. No one offered, free housing, no one offered free anything. Much less a shelter. I did it by myself and so can these people.
CJS, Houston, Texas (Sent Feb 1, 2006 2:00:21 PM)
I think that the New Orleans disaster is one big wake up call I Think that God is trying to tell those people to get out of that town and get somewhere where it is more safe and more watchful. There are a bunch of sinners in New Orleans and God is warning thim before its too late. Warning comes before destruction.
Latoya Rogers (Sent Feb 1, 2006 4:16:02 PM)
Today I wrote a letter to a Seattle newspaper:
Katrina destruction cleanup question:
I think it's shameful that New Orleans still looks like a war zone. I would think that "clean up" would be a top priority. How can people hope to rebuild with destruction and dispare everywhere they look?
THEN I found your most excellent article with answers I dreaded to have confirmed.
In my opinion, this whole mess is just another nail in the Bush coffin.
Pat Arnone, Tumwater, WA (Sent Feb 1, 2006 5:15:02 PM)
That is so typical- the lack of compassion that comes through in these posts. You people have no idea what these people have to go through day to day. You just think that these things can be repaired over night and people can just get back to their lives. Their lives are gone- try to comprehend that. You wake up one day and there is NOTHING to go back to- life as you know it has been changed forever. How many of you could step outside of your comfort zone and deal with a gut blow like that. I tell you it would be very few. Keep your head up Louisiana; despite what these posts may portray there are alot of people rooting for you!
Sid, Mandeville, LA (Sent Feb 1, 2006 5:24:20 PM)
I recently drove from Gulf Shores, AL to New Orleans (along the coast where able) and was appalled by the conditions remaining there. Thank God when the railroads have a huge derailment, Hulcher is there immediately to begin the cleanup. Why can't other clean-up/recovery teams learn from them? My heart breaks for the families living this nightmare. How do you come out of your FEMA trailer each morning to face the same deplorable situation?
Ann, Savanna, IL (Sent Feb 1, 2006 8:57:18 PM)
My question for the people "in charge" is, why don't they burn up those big mounds of debris. To me it would make great sense and also save a lot of money just to set all that wood and other debri on fire. And let it burn for days if not weeks then what ever doesn't burn up haul it off to the dump. Maybe that makes too much sense and would be to easy? I feel for all those who are going through this mess. Because I believe there is a way more affective way to clean this up faster. You always got greedy people looking out for themselves only. And that's what's going on will all those people tring to milk the system and only "hooking up" their buddies. Peace to everyone because this mess ain't worth dying for! By the way I did live on the Mississippi Gulf Coast for over 4 years. I left there just a little over a year ago. There is always a place and prayer in my heart for ALL!
Tyler Z., Vacaville, CA (Sent Feb 1, 2006 9:47:07 PM)
We sensed it, we smelled it comming, we didn't want to see, we turned our attention when we could, we layed down, took a nap, tried to distract ourselves, became tired, angry, depressed, disgusted, some of us may have been even suicidal. But this is something none the less that we can only over come by standing in our best light and not giving up and not sitting on the sidelines. This is us America, we have put ourselves here and we always have the choice to make impact on our lives and the lives of others. Don't give in! Don't be tempted to just voice your opinion and then go back to watching the TV. Organize and make a difference, anything else is from the evil one!
Steve Austin Cincinnati Oh (Sent Feb 1, 2006 11:24:52 PM)
HELLO...America?...Anyone?... I hope a million people read this. This is not rocket science. You so called intellects that read this story and are under the false impression that you know what is going on. Or you yuppies that simply write a statement to defend your government and corporations are complete buffoons. This story was intended to give us the press coverage that we so desperately need. New Orleans has received more media attention than Mississippi and Alabama combined. We are in horrible shape down here CURRENTLY. Have you not seen the other stories on this issue. It's not just the debris cleanup, it's everything. The cleanup is incomplete 5 months after the storm which is understandable. Yet, the reconstruction isn't underway. 9,000 applicants are still waiting for FEMA trailers to live in. The unemployed are still unemployed. And the term lazy, we do not understand that word in Mississippi. Get a clue America. The year is not 1860. We do not ride horses. We are diverse in our communities. And yes we wear shoes. Mississippi has gone by the wayside in the eyes of America. 9/11, no prob. Tsunami, gotcha. Katrina, here's some bucks, spend them well. Oh yeah, you have no control over the allocation of funds from the federal government. This area was encountering an economic renaissance until this catastrophe. Now we take our position at the bottom again for another 15 years. Thanks America.
P.S.- Can you fathom 90,000 square miles of destruction? 65,000+ homes totally destroyed in Harrison County Mississippi alone?
Nelson Ballew, Gulfport, MS (Sent Feb 2, 2006 2:52:55 AM)
After spending two weeks down in the tri- county area around gulfport as a GSA emergency worker hundreds of miles away from my family,what i seen that was devestating also was people going from shelter too shelter taking way more than what they needed by the vehicle load at times ; and fema letting them do it. what was with all the hostility and being cursed at,being treated unfairly while i was there by people down there.They knew the storm was coming in for days and the area is prone for hurricanes and such.Everbody wants too point fingers at Fema but what about the states and local governments where were/are they?
emt,Gaston,SC (Sent Feb 2, 2006 5:13:08 AM)
This is what these "red states" deserve. They voted for Bush and his cronyism and his "let them eat cake," mantra. You vote on single issues such as abortion, and then wonder how the GOP can be so corrupt right in front of your face! This country is declining rapidly with health care, pensions, jobs education all in jeopardy. But as long as Bush says everything is fine you believe despite the fact that you do not have health insurance or a pension. As long as he rails against "gays' he can count on you on election day.
eartha James (Sent Feb 2, 2006 10:53:36 AM)
Folks, your representatives and all their friends in DC don't care about you. Certainly or local rep. cares because he is one of you. The others right now are trying to dump the Abromowitz money so why don't a few of you take a trip to Washington. Make a media event out of it to shame the greedy sobs! Demand your share of the gop's cash box. Really go for it. Band send off, wives kissing husbands, husbands kissing kids, everybody waving and crying and have the fema bus break down after about 100 feet. They are screwing with you ! Go for it.
terry malone II Marseille, France 13001 (Sent Feb 2, 2006 11:04:28 AM)
First of all, the Corps of Engineers has nothing to do with actual hands removal of materials. In disasters, the Corps works as quality assurance inspectors in Debris, Temp Housing, Temp Blue roofs, Ice and Water distrubution. The Corps can tell a company like Ashbritt the agenda for a given week, month, etc. The Corps then goes and insures the job is being done as agreed upon. The problem stems with companies like Ashbritt take that agenda and see how they can twist it to their advantage..they do this until they are called out on it and then play dumb. I know because I was down the in Louisiana from Sept. 4- Nov. 2. What these big companies do in the beginning of storms is call their main stormtracking buddies that follow them around all year so they have a base to get get started. Then knowing that it takes the Gov't a little while to set they are out cherrypicking the big piles and leaving a mess of small debris. Ashbritt was in Jefferson Parish-4 miles from New Orleans and then suddenly, packed up and left for MS with all of those "buddy" contractors, leaving a company named Ceres to restart the whole process over again, causes many days of wasted time and energy
Joe (Sent Feb 2, 2006 11:19:46 AM)
HELLO...Nelson Ballew....i think...you said whatwas needed...to make some understand...we are not just a bunch of slobbering hicks...we are Americans...STILL suffering...a horrible disaster
andy,ms (Sent Feb 2, 2006 12:17:40 PM)
Five months later and it seems that much of the nation feel this disaster movie has gone on too long down here. We of the TV and instant gratification generations are too used to seeing lifetimes, wars, and just about every aspect of life run, beginning to end, in a few short hours. We are then ready for some other diversion.
The one great lesson we have learned down here is PATIENCE. Yes, we get frustrated with incompetence, bureaucracy, and red tape but we are also dependent upon ourselves and our neighbors to get the long job of recovery going. Who's in charge? We are. This is our home, our jobs, our family, and our future. We must do the rebuilding to make it ours. We must direct the future course of every aspect of the reclamation of this, our home. We cannot expect others to do it for us. We accept and appreciate the input of others, but the process is ours until the last nail is driven in the recovery.
Some say we are too busy crying and moaning. We say, "Get out of our way and let us do it right." Come to help, not hinder. Some say we are lazy. Name another area of the country where the local power company (Mississippi Power) could restore power too all who could accept it in just 12 days after such a disaster. The cooperatives finished shortly after that. That is planning and execution of that plan.
Are we being ripped off buy the clean-up contractor?
Attorneys will surely make some handsome fees sorting that issue out.
Will the pecovery take 3, 5, 10 years? Who knows? One thing for sure, Mississipians will do it right and do it well. PATIENCE.
Dick Lyon, Pass Christian (formerly Long Beach), MS (Sent Feb 2, 2006 1:18:27 PM)
I have read all of the messages on this page. And one thing stands out. The government is F*****G up this situation more and more. When are the people in America going to go to Washington, DC and demand that their tax dollars be used correctly by the theiving Government. It time to organize and do something. Stop talking and stand in front of the White House.
Let's GO!!!! Presents will make them look out of the Window and see that we mean business. I will be praying for all involved.!!!! Meet me in front of the White House on 2/3/2006 at 9:00am!!! Let's see who is really concerned.!!!
D. Davis, Washington DC (Sent Feb 2, 2006 2:05:40 PM)
This is yet one more indication that our response to Katrina -- at best -- is on par with that of a third world country. FEMA's response has been -- and continues to be -- shameful and disgusting. Thanks W -- mission accomplished, once again.
Michael Trinkley, Columbia, SC (Sent Feb 2, 2006 2:09:44 PM)
I like many others were contacted to see if we could provide large pieces of equipment to haul debris from Hancock county MS, This was just before Thanksgiving, I was given a contract to remove upwards to 600 cubic yards a day per truck from Waveland and bay ST Louis. I was asked to provide 15 special built trucks that each would haul at least 100 cubic yard each per load. It was further told to us, that we had to be onsite ready to work for Ashbritt within 48 hours after signing the agreement. Looking at the agreement and the potential volume of work and potential dollars. We were on site within 36 hours, only to find out that they weren’t ready for us, our trucks sat for a few days while they tried to find work for us, they wanted these huge trucks to drive around and only pick up selected small amounts of materials, from certain locations, these trucks were lucky once they started rolling to pick up on avg 100-200 yards of material each day. All that Ashbritt was paying us was $6.00 per cubic yard, out of this we had to pay the truckers and expenses. This deal only lasted 4 weeks when we learned that this operation was so far messed up, and that Ashbritt had to many other sweet heart deals, going on. With the volume of materials in the areas, if these trucks were allowed to drive down a road these trucks could have hauled several hundred yards of material each day for each truck. This would have been a good deal for all of us, but between Ashbritt and the Army corp watch dogs, it was clear that if you wasn’t in there inner circle, no money could be made, we packed up and moved back to Maine. And a lesson learned was never to look at business again in this area.
bob, Maine (Sent Feb 2, 2006 6:10:40 PM)
"The tax payers are also getting screwed", but, not due what Bush is doing. We as tax payers have sent billions of dollars to Miss., and NO and we are not getting our moneies worth. No one is in charge and yet only a few at the top can maake decisions that halt work and cause lost of time and money. The local gov't in NO have put such restrictions on debris clean up that nothing is getting done and those decisions change ever day. This week the local gov't of Ray Naggan only permitted the clean up of 3,three houses. At this rate NO will not be clean until the year 2010. There is no work and hundreds of truckers have gone broke and left the area due to the lack of work. People and groups of people have put their time, energy and moneies into trying to help the people of NO and I am one of those and I'm going broke. Ray Nagan has put a whole tier of local contractors over all the subcontractors and that tier has sucked about 140 million dollars from the clean up efforts. If anyone is really interested in seeing what is happening in the Katrina desaster go to NO and talk to the sub-contractors.
Ray Yinger (Sent Feb 2, 2006 9:49:15 PM)
bob, maine...please do look at doing business in MS. again...but after AshBritt is gone .....we may have to run thier a**es out....and it's getting about time ...but you were lucky at $6 a yard now it goes for $3....and they get $17?..yeah right
andy,ms (Sent Feb 3, 2006 9:24:28 AM)
comment from a civil engineer, originally from MS, and who has been involved in a lot of major FEMA and post war events around the world:
To the Halliburton,Flour,Bectel etc.. haters - go to Engineering News Record and try to find Ashbrit. Are they in the top 10 engineering and construction firms in the country? No. Are they close? No. Ashbrit from Pomapmo Beach? There is a center of engr excellence for you. Don't mention them in the same sentence as halliburton please.
Large E/C firms with proven track records, approved procurement programs, and technical depth were specifically not chosen because everyone wanted to make political brownie points saying to the press how much they used "local" firms. Well, you all got exactly what you asked for - a fubar program with a sleaze ball firm. What did you expect from a fourth rate company that focuses strictly on raping federal relief programs (not actually producing). Billion dollar program management experience is not found at the local AGA. No small town local government is geared for this type of management task.
Instead of explaining how large federal procurement programs work and focusing on how people and companies could make a difference or participate, the main stream media went on a bashing frenzy fixated only on Bush hatred and blaming everything on the infamous "Halliburton" bogey man (Shaw Group by the way is a fund raiser for the DEMOCRATS, but you would never have known by the coverage). The facts that large E/C firms almost always use local subcontractors, have established proven plans for small and minority business participation, and can be held accountable where others (seemingly like Ashbrit) cannot were just dismissed because they didn't fit the anti-bush agenda. They were HOPING that this sitution would arise so they could scream some more.
When I came home from overseas in October and saw the limited number of resources being employed i told my family "at this rate it will take two years just to get the basics done". That isn't far off it seems. I hope for their sakes that I find someone like KBR, Flour, or someone similiar in charge and pushing the effort.
oh by the way - the rules of the game are known as "the FAR" (Federal Aquisition Regulations). If anyone wants to play with the Feds then you better read them. If Ashbrit isn't playing fair the agency to call is the Inspector General. they are really, really good at prosecuting FAR breakers.
rw (Sent Feb 3, 2006 10:50:50 AM)
Those of you showing your ignorance by telling those on the Gulf Coast to get a grip and do the cleanup themselves, need to take a little trip to that area. I have spent time in BSL and Waveland doing volunteer work and there are simply NO words for what the area looks like. We're not alking about a little debris here and there, some roof damage, a few shrubs scattered about...folks this is like a bomb hit. Imagine the entire contents and all construction material of almost every building for miles and miles and miles....entire contents of houses, drywall, trees , cars, appliances, EVERYTHING that goes into making a house or other building, scattered everywhere. You can't just put your boots on and clear the lot. It is impossible without heavy equipment. So don't speak out of ignorance,rather, drive on down and see for yourself. By the way, those I met were not complaiing, but were working hard to do what they could to clean up. God Bless them all....
peggy dugan, naples fla. (Sent Feb 4, 2006 7:53:02 PM)
My heart goes out to all those that have had their lives destroyed by Katrina. It is so sad that the majority of the american people have gotten so consumed with greed, bitterness and selfishness that we critisize rather than try to help the people of MS. No I don't mean send them money,I mean pull together and rebuild. Now, for the dirty words, WORK TOGETHER.... If just a few people from each city of each state volunteered to take a couple of days to go down and work and live with the people of MS. If the local goverment wants to be a part of the effort let them foot the cost of travel, food and lodging of the volunteers. Lets pull together and there won't be a reason for companies like Ashbritt to be in the clean up effort. Try taking that money Pres.Bush, no let me reword that, remove the word TAKING.. try USING the money saved for the deficit, medicare, social security and prescription drugs for the elderly and needy. Had my husband not gone to find work in MS and being promised good wages, just to come home 3 months later poorer than he was when he left, from sitting in the camper waiting for someone to give them the o.k. to start moving the debris. Getting to work only a very few days while there. That's what it took for me to see how bad the people had it, and to imagine if that were my children playing around all that debris. Please can we not all pull together and make a difference for the sake of the people and our country. I don't believe our country is as much as a lost cause as it appears to be..
Charlotte, Corbin,Ky (Sent Feb 6, 2006 3:21:46 AM)
Thank you, rw, for your informed comments. As a former administrative employee for Halliburton, I also recognize that by awarding these huge contracts to less than upper level firms will keep the gulf in chaos for many years. Bash whatever political leader or agency you choose, but the fact is that firms like Halliburton and other established and qualified companies have the leadership and resources to get the job done in an efficient and timely manner. If you worried about lining the pockets of big business with fat contracts, you would have at least had results to go with it. Now you have some nabob and his buddies living off the fat contracts, and nothing to show for it but more complaining. Maybe too late now, but you better get some firms in there that know how to handle an enormous project like this.
dan engel (Sent Feb 6, 2006 2:25:22 PM)
i think it's true the rich get richer....and the rest of us ...just do what we gotta do...sadly enough
andy,ms (Sent Feb 6, 2006 4:25:55 PM)
Those of you who label us as "chronic complainers" think you have a point, since that is probably all of what you see in the media. However, my parents, ages 70 and 60, and I went for seven days without running water, and three weeks without power, AND they and I did ALL of our clean-up work OURSELVES, with no help from ANYONE. Granted, we are 90 miles from the coast, but we had four oak trees over six feet in diameter uprooted by the wind, as well as about twenty or so assorted pines and other softwoods. Limbs, pieces of other people's houses, and other assorted debris litteraly covered our yard. Can you imagine? You can't, until you've seen it in person. My father bought an industrial chainsaw and sawed on those trees every day until he cut them up- the huge ones we busted with axes and wedges like it was 1860. Don't tell ME to stop whining and expecting help. We NEVER ASKED FOR ANY, and NEVER GOT ANY from anyone except our neighbors down the street.
Helen, Laurel, MS (Sent Feb 8, 2006 5:24:23 PM)
Hey, Bonnie from Ocean Springs MS & Susi Folks from California... I'm the TEXAS wife of a very hardworking TEXAS subcontractor in Mississippi. He works 7 days a week, 10-12 hr days hauling debris near Laurel, MS. There are lots of wonderful MS residents there that have been VERY happy for their hard work & help, regardless of what state we're from. My husband is missing seeing his 8mth old daughter grow up to be there hauling debris. And yes, it's helping us buy formula & diapers here at home, but it's not sending me shopping at Macy's. So, quit judging hard working people that are trying to help. And quit whining about their "slow moving trucks". How would you prefer they transport the debris? Helicopter? The same people that complained that no one was running to the rescue immediately, are now complaining that out of state people ARE helping. We are not greedy, we are trying to make a living. And by the way, it's helping people in the process, so we feel pretty good about it. Before you start complaining about 'greedy' out-of-staters making money there, remember it's the surrounding states like TEXAS that took in hundreds of thousand of people & are STILL housing them. And you two ladies, if you're willing to go work "your fanny off" for an "hourly rate", then buy yourself $40,000 truck, a $14000 dump trailer, a $50,000 backhoe, a $20000 manlift, a $30000 bobcat & get you some commercial insurance, a CDL, and worker's comp insurance for the flaggers you'll have to hire....and HEAD THAT WAY!!! I'm sure since you're both experts, you'll be just right for the job!
Kris, Taylor, TEXAS (Sent Feb 10, 2006 3:56:33 PM)
To all who think they know what things are really like. You don't know. I worked in Pompano Beach in FLA and the debris clean up when smooth as possible. It is pretty simple, the corp needs to get their head out of their a.....s and let the people work. For gods sake, nobody is going to drop debris on their heads or a car or a person. Use common sense people because people don't have the resources to clean it up thereselves. Believe me it costs a lot of money to purchase the equipment to hall the debris away, not to mention you have to wait for 3 to 10 weeks to receive your money. Common sense is all we need. It will take outside sources plus locals to clean this mess up. Pompano didn't even use their local contractor (Ashbritt) to help because they probably knew how bad they really are.
Keeba, Ohio (Sent Feb 10, 2006 8:27:54 PM)
FOR SALE-THREE DUMP TRUCKS. My husband brought home his three dump trucks from the MS Gulf Coast because he couldn't get work orders (I guess he wasn't in the right "click"). Image that, all the destruction to clean up and he couldn't get work. The local governments better stand up for their counties or they will never get cleaned up. My husband and the crew he was working with stood idle most of the time. The whole crew called it quits and went home. He started out working in New Orleans but left from there becuase he wasn't getting paid for the work he had done. He's still owed money from there. He'll never go back and both places have left a bad taste in our mouthes. Thanks for the memories.
Nancy, Vicksburg, MS (Sent Feb 13, 2006 12:51:18 PM)
I think a class action law suite IS NEEDED AGAINST ashbrit-core, contacted them prior to going down, then when we got there it was ..fill out more paper work and maybe we will call you,wellas of today 2-13 06 not a call from anyone, I spent over $60k,plus 3 months away from family,, offering to help and all that work to be done,yet still no work for me because the "big contractors" have taken it all!! Sorry, it just sucks...
KOHANOWICH, MARC (Sent Feb 13, 2006 5:09:25 PM)
Kris,Taylor,Texas....i know where you are coming from...and i'm proud your husband is getting to "work his fanny off".....many from north M.S. couldn't go because AshBritt didn't want to pay hardly anything ....or would not offer work everyday...i still say we should run AshBritts a** off and use more good hard working folks ...like your husband and others like him!!!!
andy,booneville ms. (Sent Feb 14, 2006 5:46:34 PM)
I think we should all get together with D. Davis and set a date and time to meet in front of the White House to express our frustration and anger at the entire situation and to demand accountability. D. Davis, give me a couple of weeks to make some arrangements and I'll meet you there. Heck, here's a challenge to all of you Baby Boomers out there. Remember those big protests during Vietnam? the Civil Rights movement? Why are we sitting at home and doing nothing? Certainly, there are some Baby Boomers out there who are willing to organize and show the younger generation how it should be done! I'm packin' my bags and gettin' ready to get to DC. Let's roll!
Flower Power Rules (Sent Feb 16, 2006 2:20:46 PM)
"Flower Power Rules"...true...but old bones...don't roll as well as they did 40years ago.....Da** wish they did though!!!
andy,ms (Sent Feb 16, 2006 9:01:55 PM)
seems all i can do is Bitc*...these days...LOL!!!
andy,ms (Sent Feb 16, 2006 9:04:21 PM)
Hey, Dan Engel! Let's get Halliburton in there because I know they would do a great job and would never even consider overcharging. I look to their work in rebuilding Iraq. WHAT A COMPANY!
Jane, Southern Mississippi (Sent Feb 16, 2006 9:29:02 PM)
My husband and sons secured a subcontract to clean up debris in the 9th ward early in November. They purchased the appropriate equipment (two small dump trailers, two trucks, and a small loader), and left for the Gulf Coast in mid-November. Just about the time they left, the contractors were ordered out of the 9th ward, and were told to expect work to begin again around the 1st of December. So, they went to Mississippi to wait, and hopefully get some work there. Despite a great effort, they were not able to get a contract that lasted more than a few days before FEMA, or the Corps of Engineers, or some unnamed authority put a stop to the work for one reason or another, basically a mystery to all involved at our level. December 1st came and went, and work did not resume in the 9th ward. Because we had invested all of our resources into the equipment, insurance, etc., they could not afford to come home until all hope of working was lost. They went down there because the economy in Michigan is really bad. We know several people that had gone to Florida and worked after the hurricane, and it was a way to survive the winter and the slow economy. It seemed like a good plan to keep us going until things improved here. It has turned out to be a disaster! On January 18, my husband had a heart attack in Slidell, LA. He has not been able to work since then, but it would not make any difference. He has exhausted himself trying to get something going. He finally got a contract to install FEMA trailers. They guy they were going to work for has been doing it for a couple of months. Before they could start working, you guessed it! FEMA stopped releasing trailers to be installed. They say they don't have any down there. I went to Louisiana after my husband had his heart attack, and I saw many FEMA trailers sitting in fenced areas, allegedly waiting to be placed. I can't help wondering what has happened to them. I can't help wondering why any of this is taking so long. I could not believe the destruction, and general chaos, five months after Katrina. Everyone I talked to, including doctors and nurses, had suffered significant losses, and all had their stories of nightmares in dealing with the government. My husband and son are getting ready to come home. We are experiencing financial disaster. We are of the "boomer" generation, so it is going to be very hard for us to recover, particularly with my husband's health the way it is. At the same time, it is hard to feel sorry for yourself when you are surrounded by so many people who have lost everything. Somehow, we hope our government wakes up and thinks about the people of this country; those who are suffering loss from the hurricane, and all those who have lost their jobs because of the poor economy in certain parts of the country.